Scripture Text (NRSV)
Luke 13:31-35
13:31 At that very hour some Pharisees came and said to him, "Get
away from here, for Herod wants to kill you."
13:32 He said to them, "Go and tell that fox for me, 'Listen, I am
casting out demons and performing cures today and tomorrow, and on the
third day I finish my work.
13:33 Yet today, tomorrow, and the next day I must be on my way,
because it is impossible for a prophet to be killed outside of
Jerusalem.'
13:34 Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and
stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather
your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and
you were not willing!
13:35 See, your house is left to you. And I tell you, you will not
see me until the time comes when you say, 'Blessed is the one who
comes in the name of the Lord.'"
Comments:
Herod a "fox"? Probably because Jesus likens himself later to a
motherly "hen" gathering (with the usual difficulty that hens have
with their offspring) her chicks. The fox goes for the most
substantial menu item. Any other ideas from anyone?
I've just started preparing this sermon and would be glad of ongoing
conversation.
I'm George and made the "fox" and "mother hen" comment. And I want to
see if others are preparing now two Sundays in advance and how you do
it. I'm working currently with theological students on "preaching -
and living - the lectionary" and will encourage them to work within
these pages and contribute to this discussion. Re fox and hen, is this
a sample of the sharp humour of Jesus, assuming that he is accurately
reported. The Gospels, especially the words attributed to Jesus, are
by no means as artless as is assumed by surprisingly casual
commentators. George
This might be a dumb question ... but why was Herod going to kill
Jesus at this point in Luke? It seems all he's been doing is telling
parables - nothing too outrageous yet. Beginning to muse ... HSinON
Welcome! Two weeks ahead is a great deal of time, we are pretty
desperate here! Maybe a few can get started early. I would also direct
you to a site called Sermonwriter and ask for a free trial. It is a
good exegisical site.
according to the Interpretor's Bible, With in the ancient world, fox
has a raige of possible meanings, its crafiness, its lack of strength,
it proclivity for malicious destructiveness, and its intelligence.
Nancy-Wi
Jesus as a motherhen is a beautiful image. Why would people (of
Jerusalem) turn away from it? Why would they want to kill one like
that?
Maybe we reject even what is good for us.
RB In Canada
Jesus likens the tyrant Herod to a murderous fox. He speaks of himself
as a mother hen who would sacrifice her own life to shield her
children from danger.
"Jerusalem, my happy home, when shall I come to thee?" we sing. "When
shall my sorrows have an end? They joys when shall I see?"
What sharp contrast Jesus brings to this image when he mourns,
"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones
those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your
children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you
were not willing!"
For perhaps the past five decades, it is the latter of these images
which more fully describes our contemporary image of Jerusalem. The
"happy harbor of the saints" has become the harbor for centuries-old
grudges. The "sweet and pleasant soil" has been soaked with the blood
of battle.
This reality, a shattered terrestrial counterpart of the heavenly
Jerusalem, is not inconsistent with the words of scripture assigned
for today. The temporal nature of all of earthly life is lifted up.
"Know this for certain," said the Lord to Abram, "that your offspring
shall be aliens in a land that is not theirs" for four hundred years.
As history bears out, even after Abraham's descendents return to the
awaited land of promise, they discover it to be flawed--pre-owned and
still claimed.
Further, even family values have their limitations, implies the
psalmist: "Though my father and my mother forsake me, the Lord will
sustain me."
"Once again we are reminded that we have no abiding city on this
earth." How often clergy have prefaced the announcement of death with
these words. It is in this face of the temporal that Paul reminds us
of the premanent; in the face of our status as earthly refugees that
we are granted eternal citizenship; in the face of frail deteriorating
bodies that we glimpse our body of his glory. "Our citizenship is in
heaven, it is from there that we are expecting a Savior, the Lord
Jesus Christ."
"Wait patiently for the Lord," says the psalmist.
by Twila Schock and Bill Swanson in "Sundays and Seasons 2004."
Wouldn't you think the "opportune time" from last week continue on
here? Temptation also turned into opposition for Jesus here.
Interesting side note: The Pharisee generally doesn't like Herod,
since he is not a pure Jew, and a puppet ruler for the Romans. (Did
the Pharisee care, or did they just try to drive Jesus away?)
In any case, Jesus response was straight out provoking to the
authorities. But there is more in his answers: 1) Jesus knows his
destiny of dying in Jerusalem; 2) He also knows that when his time is
not up, he still need to carry-out the work. 3) Even though he know
that people will reject and kill Him, he still love them. 4) At the
end "until the time comes", He knows that He will prevail and they
will see Him again.
Another side note: "the third day I finish my work" = "It is
finished!" on the cross.
Possible application: We all face opposition, in order to overcome
opposition we need to know what is our final destination (otherwise we
will accomodate instead). If our life is align in the plan of God, we
should continue to press forward in the time God allocated for us
before our time is up. However, genuine love and compassion should be
what drive us forward, and not just "purpose-driven"
"getting-it-done". There is no guarantee that people will response to
us (or to God), but at the end, "until the time comes", God's will
shall be done.
Personally, I think I had it easy (may be because I am stillyoung and
inexperience). Many DPSers here wrote about oppositions upon
oppositions in their ministry (most of them come from the religious
neo-pharisee of our days). I really admire your faithfulness to
continue to press forward, for doing the work, and for the willingness
to follow the footstep of Master into Jerusalem for your death as
well.
Oh God, help me to be like you and like your disciples I see here.
Coho, Midway City.
Most foxes feed on mice, voles, rabbits, birds’ eggs, fruit, large
insects, and carrion. Because their prey is small, foxes are solitary
rather than pack hunters. They generally work territories of less than
8 sq km (less than 3 sq mi), which they defend from other foxes.
(SOURCE: fox (animal) Microsoft(R) Encarta (R) 2003.)
Hmmmm.....Herod: killing small prey (the slaughter of the innocents),
worked within a relatively small area (Judea), defends his territory
against other foxes (again, the innocents and then, of course, Jesus
the Nazarene. No rivals will be tolerated in his territory!!!
The term Fox seems apt, yes?
Oops - just remembered those were two different Herods - the slaughter
of the innocents and the fixation over Jesus were two different Herods.
Sorry for the slip of mind there.
The "ebb and flow", the "drum beat of history/cuture", contained in
Jesus' reference to himself in constrast to the Pharisees and Herod,
may speak at an applied level to this contemporary time of
post-modernity. The relevance of femininity in relation to
"metaphorical theology", I believe, has power to unlock spirituality
not realized if one remains frozen in modernity's linear (rational)
thinking mode, "power over" mode in authority, and many other
patriarchal focused modes such as competition, isolationism, and
individualism, to the exclusion of the holistic covenant-community
resources. Values relevant to femininity may include such issues as
empowerment, facilitative helping relations, trust-building, ultimate
care/concern, cooperation, nurturing growth in faith stages, deep
learning,and covenant-community-making connections, (especially in
small group spiritual formation settings). The historical/cultural
"paradigm shift" engages all of us in an "in-between-time", an
eschatological moment not unlike the womb giving birth to the New
Testament ministries (preaching, teaching, and healing) of Jesus. What
we do with the "Living Word of God", the Divine Self-disclosure of God
making intervention in our historical/cultural "hour", the Sacrament
of Incarnation in the immediate experiences comprising our life
stories, I believe, is contained in the "womb" of this Biblical
Revelation. Making sense of why Jerusalem, the City of God, stoning
the Word of God, is critical to the hermeneutical act of "praying this
Holy Scripture.
critical reflections, PaideiaSCO.
we hear about Warren's Purpose driven life, here this text seems to
show Christ's passion driven life... a life not distracted from
healing people and driving out demons no matter what Herod may or may
not do.
I think Herod is called the fox becuase of the old saying regarding
"like a fox watching the chicken coop."
Herod was put in a position of guardianship of the Jews but did not
have thier best interests in mind.
Pr.del in IA
Initial thoughts:
1) the saying, "That's like telling the fox to mind the henhouse."
Don't know if it'll really fit in, but it comes to mind.
2)anonymous post person - yes; the "passion-driven" life. Very
appropriate; most people believe their lives have "purpose," and so
would see no reason to open the book (at least my congregation says
they do), whereas "passion-driven" is quite another thing. Of course,
within the context of "purpose-driven" is "passion-driven," but in
judging the book by its cover, many would not see the need to open it!
Warren's passion is evident in all his writings.
Kind of like the Bible, huh?
Sally in GA
oops - wasn't clear, sorry
Seeing the need to "open the book" - that's kind of like the Bible,
isn't it? (not Rick Warren's passion)
Sally
There is no reason to suspect that here the Pharisees are party to
some plan of entrapment. Some Pharisees differed strongly with Jesus
on interpretations of the law, but some also seemed open to Jesus (Lk
7.36; 11.37; 14.1). Luke certainly gives no totally unfavorable
portrait of them. A Pharisee was a moderating voice in the Jewish
council when it was dealing with the early church (Acts 5.34), and
some of the members of the church were Pharisees (Acts 15.5). In fact,
according to Luke, Paul himself acknowledged near the close of his
ministry, not "I WAS a Pharisee" but "I AM a Pharisee" (Acts 23.6).
Luke provides preachers and teachers with an opportunity to correct
the very generalized and often uninformed prejudice against Pharisees
which exists in some churches.
Jesus' response to Herod as "that fox" is unclear in its implication.
In the Old Testament the fox is destructive; in Greek literature,
clever. In any case, Jesus is neither intimidated nor deterred by the
threat, because he works under the divine imperative: "I must go on my
way."
Shalom
As people continue to watch the Passion in the 2nd week, one relevant
hook that could be used in this text is the emphasis on how Jesus did
it all willingly, since his life was all devoted to it.
"Father, my heart is ready!" Beautifully non-biblical!
Coho, Midway City
Someone commented on the correcting of spelling errors in last week's
discussion. I'd like to add my opinion in that area.
Certainly we type quickly, and often make typographical errors. Some
of us correct them ourselves in the next post with an embarrassed
sigh. I believe that most of us overlook the spelling errors when the
meaning is clear. However, it is good that we clarify when the meaning
can become clouded, as when the misspelled word is another word
meaning something completely different. If no one corrects our
mistakes, how will we learn?
examples: (confirmation, conformation) (united, untied) (Hollow be thy
name...)
Spelling has become so secondary in this computer age, especially
since spell-checkers do not know what the righter :o) intends, neither
do they contain many of our Bible words like "Thy." Let us continue to
take advantage of the opportunity to grow, and to correct one another
in love, so that our language can become more clear.
Michelle
HsinOn Luke T. Johnson in Sacra Pagina thinks the Pharisees were
trying to get Jesus to leave the area so they could discredit him.
Luke ( the gospel writer); Johnson says may be trying to set us up for
what happens in Jerusalem when Herod releases Jesus because all he
wanted a sign. Jesus is implying that he will leave but in God's time
not Herod's or the Pharsee's. Jesus knows that he will be killed in
Jerusalem because that is God's plan. Padresac
HsinOn Luke T. Johnson in Sacra Pagina thinks the Pharisees were
trying to get Jesus to leave the area so they could discredit him.
Luke ( the gospel writer); Johnson says may be trying to set us up for
what happens in Jerusalem when Herod releases Jesus because all he
wanted a sign. Jesus is implying that he will leave but in God's time
not Herod's or the Pharsee's. Jesus knows that he will be killed in
Jerusalem because that is God's plan. Padresac
Just a couple of notes:
The third day when Jesus finish's his work seems to be the
resurrection(the third day) and not just the cross.
Second, In Jesus's mourning there seems to be a hint grace. God has
sent prophet after prophet to the city, never giving up, and now Jesus
willing to be the mother hen is standing at the gates once more. God
seems to never give up, so much so, that God comes incarnately.
RB IN Canada
Colleagues,
For years I have come to this text, and I have focused on the chicken.
Wrong. Seventy six times in scripture, the word for "corners" (the
four corners of the Jewish prayer shawl) is translated, "wings". It is
my conviction that Jesus is longing to bring the people of Jerusalem
into the power of his prayer life. To receive the care of God through
the prayers of Christ is an even more powerful image than that of his
mother-henning them. Remember the woman who suffered from a flow of
blood for many years? She was in a crowd and reached out and touched
the fringe of his garment, HIS PRAYER SHAWL, and she was healed. Jesus
felt God's power flow out of HIM, just as the power of sickness flowed
out of the woman. Jesus wants Jerusalem Jerusalem to be healed for
service to God, and not to be protected from encountering the
troublesome people on earth. Remember THE PASSION? Jesus was not
protected under a hen's wings, but encountered the sins of the world
face to face and overcame them. On the cross he prayed, "Father
forgive them (the most troublesome people on earth); they just don't
know." Focus on the Jewish prayer shawl. Look it up on the web. In
Hebrew: tallis or talleth. The fringe is: tse-tse. Remember: PRAYER!
NOT POULTRY!
Oklahoma Irishman
Colleagues,
For years I have come to this text, and I have focused on the chicken!
Wrong! Seventy-six times in scripture, the word for "corners" (the
four corners of the Jewish prayer shawl) is translated, "wings". Jesus
was calling Jerusalem, Jerusalem to be gathered into the strength of
his prayer, and not under the protection of chicken wings.
Remember the woman with the flow of blood? She reached out and touched
the fringe of the garment of Jesus (his prayer shawl) and she was
healed. It is better to be healed for service than to be protected
from encountering the troublesome things of life, like hiding under
the wings of a chicken.
In chapter 13, Jesus is talking about ministry which brings about the
Kingdom of God. That is to say, sacrifice. Dedication. Engaging the
principalities and powers of earth. What is needed? Prayer, not
Poultry.
Look it up on the web: Jewish Prayer Shawl (Hebrew: tallis or tallith).
Oklahoma Irishman
I like the hen and fox imagery as well, but I am struck by the today,
tomorrow, and next day comment that Jesus makes twice in the Gospel.
I serve a small, rural congregation that tends to look at their
ministry in terms of yesterday..."it was better when I was
young"..."We've always done it this way". I think there must be some
signifance, beyond the resurrection foretaste, to Jesus emphasizing
current and future ministry.
I would love thoughts on how to present this idea without completely
alienating the congregation.
PBG in IL
Last week, the Temptations of Christ in Luke chapter 4,the governing
image was "Why Am I here?" What is my purpose? This week the governing
image could well be related to that one: "I know who I am and why I am
here----but where am I going?"
Larry Isbell
A few weeks ago as I was flipping through channels on my television
set I caught a commentary on terrorism. Perhaps it was a diplomat who
was speaking. Anyway, she said that terrorism cannot be erradicated by
war. Terrorism will cease when all the world's children have what they
need. At coffee the other day someone called the war on terrorism the
"post modern French Revolution."
Jesus wanted to level the world's playing field; give all of God's
children what they needed. This is a real-life, concrete, in the world
experience God wants for God's good earth. "The good life," we call it
in Nebraska. The problem is, you can't get there from the outside
in--peace in the kingdom cannot be forced. We are loved into the
kingdom, right? Jesus preached that the Kingdom cannot come on earth
until it is accepted in the heart. Oh how Jesus wanted to gather his
friends of the faith in Jerusalem to his bosom and protect them from
their false faith selves and nurture them. Oh how they resisted him,
even hated him for his emphasis on love. That's hard work! And it
takes a lot of time to create change. (It's easier to move people and
things by blowing them up and creating new governments. Yeah, right.)
Would he quit doing God's work because some people hated him for it?
Nope. He'd keep his schedule--love and preach and teach and
heal--knowing full well that Jerusalem would keep it's schedule, too.
As we come to the Lord's Table this Sunday, will we let Jesus protect
us from our false religious selves and nurture us? Will we let love
rule in our hearts and let Jesus change the way we seek happiness in
this life? If loving our neighbor causes people to hate us--especially
if they're gay--will we quit? Or will we keep God's schedule, knowing
full well the world will keep its schedule? What, church, what? revdlk
in ne
Oh...I almost forgot...Herod the fox...sly? That's just one thought.
Quoting another passage...foxes had holes or dins, a place to lay
their head. Also a place for safe-keeping, protection...Herod could
plot evil things "underground." Jesus lived his God-centered life in
the open. Every word face value. And he wasn't afraid. He wasn't
interested in holes or dins. He was who he was and did what he did,
both outside and inside of Jerusalem.
I'm not sure I'm preaching any of this. This is just some early
musings. revdlk
It would seem to me that we are struggling this week with imagery. In
particular, what lies behind the image of the fox, and the hen
gathering her brood under her wings.
The fox is a furtive creature. Attacks by stealth and cunning.
Difficult to pin down and will often use different methods of
approach.
This for me describes Herod. A man prone to the will of the people.
Desiring popularity and in the process by trying to be so popular,
loses all.
Compare this to Jesus who stands resolute. Preaching and healing in
the open. Not lurking around the edge of issues, but confronting them
head on.
Other than at night, a hen gathers her brood, mainly when they sense
danger. It is a protective stand in which the mother hen, will often
risk her own life, while protecting the chickens. I have seen a hen do
this, when confronted by a dog. The difficulty, is of course that the
chickens are oblivious to the danger.
Oscar Wilde tells a wonderful tale about the Robin and the Rose. The
Robin impales itself upon the thorn so that the rose might gain its
colour. I find a similar analogy in what Jesus does on the cross.
We didn't even know we were sinful. We certainly didn't think Jesus
had to die for us. It was while we were still ignorant that God
reconciled us to himself.
The furtive fox, or the resolute hen. Who is the greater?
Regards for a great week.
KGB in Aussie.
Sorry, I meant to add, regarding the Oscar Wilde story, that the Rose
was oblivious to what it cost the Robin, for the rose to receive its
glorious colour. The chickens (us) were unwilling/oblivious to the
danger we were in by our sinfulness.
My apologies for this glaring omission.
Regards, KGB
I think you're laying an egg when extending the metaphor to thinking
Jesus as a mother hen;-) Where there hen houses in his time? What's
the exigesis on this? Peace and Joy, Francis
I am being led to do a sermon series this year, The people at the
cross:through their eyes....Plus, my people are trying a midweek Bible
Study he Chose the Nails-Max Lucado... have you all see the Passion
Movie? I did last Thursday... The Leesburg-Highland Ohio area Churches
are going Saturday, 17 from my Church are going...I decided to go with
them...Yes, the scurging was difficult to watch, I wailed with the
marys...But what touched me was The actor had to be touched by Holy
Spirit to show this-Jesus EMBRACED the Cross, He desired it with whole
heart...I Know it was a dramatic license, simon of Cyrene, reluctant
at first, then sympathic, then at Golgotha, Jesus said GO HOME you
part is over, Profound words here....Only Jesus could FINISH IT!
Clerically Blonde In west ohio
Somewhere there is a story about the Wycliffe Bible Translators
working on a translation ito a language of some Canadian Indians. But
these Indians regarded the fox as a shifty coward, and the translators
didn't think that the image of the fox was the one that would connect
with that group, so they changed this to read, Go and tell that
wolverine (a really tough character). I have a lot of respect for the
Wycliffe group, but I think thye were wrong here (but I may have been
overly influenced by the absolutely hysterical portrayal oe Herod in
Jesus Christ Superstar;-)
There are plenty of portrayals of the fox as the ultimate con artist
(was it in the Walt Disney movie,Song of the South, taken from the
Uncle Remus stories, that he wears a top hat and a shabby coat and is
always up to something). If you worked for the Romans, the main thing
you had to was to protect yourelf (same attitude you can find in large
corporations and even the ministry).
To be a Puppet of the Romans was one of those positions where a little
paranoia went a long way towards sel-preservation.Now there's a
contrast:self-absorbed self-preservation against complete self-giving.
And here comes this upstart Galileean (Galilee was known for producing
people who claimed to be the Messiah and lots of other dangerous
nonsense,like political unrest).
revgilmer in texarkana
It is interesting to see how crafty the Pharisees are in suggesting
that Jesus leave for his own safety. It reminds me of last Sunday's
text in which Satan suggests things to Jesus with the pretext that he
is concerned about Jesus' physical needs, e.g turn these stones into
bread...bow before me and I will give you the kingdoms of the
world...throw yourself down and he will command his angels to bear
you. Non of these was impossible to do, but Jesus can never be told
when or when not to do something. His ministry is on heavenly
timetable. <my cent's worth> Rev. Elijah Mwitanti New Jersey
It is interesting to see how crafty the Pharisees are in suggesting
that Jesus leave for his own safety. It reminds me of last Sunday's
text in which Satan suggests things to Jesus with the pretext that he
is concerned about Jesus' physical needs, e.g turn these stones into
bread...bow before me and I will give you the kingdoms of the
world...throw yourself down and he will command his angels to bear
you. Non of these was impossible to do, but Jesus can never be told
when or when not to do something. His ministry is on heavenly
timetable. <my cent's worth> Rev. Elijah Mwitanti New Jersey
The way Jesus responds to the suggestion by the Pharisees is not
unique to this text. Whenever people assume that they can help Jesus
out, they quickly and disappointingly realize that God does not need
man to rescue him. Think about the following: Lord, don't go to
Jerusalem, they were just about to kill you...(response: get behind me
Satan). Peter picks up the sword and chops the ear off of one of
Jesus' captors...(response: put the sword in its place [he reattaches
the ear]). Judas complains about wasted perfume which should have been
sold and the money given to the poor...(response: "the poor will
always be with you" Rev. Elijah Mwitanti (pensuloson@yahoo.com
Apologies for the double post. let's see if I can do better.
The song I was thinking of is "I vow to thee, my country." The music
is actually from part of Holst's "Planet Symphony." The lyrics were
written at the end of WWI. here they are from the "lyrics
playground.com"
I VOW TO THEE MY COUNTRY (Words: Cecil Spring-Rice - 1918 / Music:
Gustav T. Holst - 1921)
I vow to thee, my country All earthly things above Entire and whole
and perfect, The service of my love; The love that asks no question,
The love that stands the test, That lays upon the altar The dearest
and the best; The love that never falters, The love that pays the
price, The love that makes undaunted The final sacrifice.
And there's another country, I've heard of long ago Most dear to them
that love her, Most great to them that know; We may not count her
armies, We may not see her King; Her fortress is a faithful heart, Her
pride is suffering; And soul by soul and silently Her shining bounds
increase, And her ways are ways of gentleness, And all her paths are
peace.
Francis asks about hen houses. Jesus did speak of hens. And there was
a cock that crowed three times in the Passion narrative. So these fowl
were not foreign to the people and there were likely hen houses
around. I never much thought of the Israelites eating chicken or eggs,
however.
Since it got flagged again this week, I've just got to say ...
has anyone but me considered that our sister in confirmation class
spelled it confOrmation on purpose as a commentary, or joke?
Sally in GA
Just some comments on the posts here. First, this Herod is not the
Herod the Great that had the innocents killed. It is Herod Antipas,
Tetrarch of Galilee who had John the Baptist beheaded. Second, Jewish
rabbis routinely referred to people who were worthless and
insignificant as a “fox.” Third, the Greek word that has been
translated here as “hen” can more accurately be translated as “bird.”
(See Deuteronomy 32:11) Fourth, the metaphor of the fox and hen can be
reached, but to what purpose. As one poster said, “Where is the
exegesis here?” A more practical reach is the comment Jesus made about
three days and the bodily resurrection to complete his mission.
Finally, did anyone pickup on the desire of Jesus to have all the
inhabitants of Jerusalem return to God and be saved. Jesus was
crucified for all mankind of all times. It grieves him that so many
“were not willing!” God Bless. Pastor Chuck. St. Louis, MO
Friends, I decided last week that the title I'll be working with for
this week is "Finishing the Work." I submit my title & the focus text
to the local access channel to be posted on the computerized community
bulletin board church ad. At lunchtime today I happened to see the
church ad proclaiming the title "Finishing the WorD." I'm not sure
whether to call and correct the posting or change my title. Perhaps
the error brings into play another dimension for the sermon! :>))
Robbie in KS
Foxes, foxes, everywhere. Apparently biblical scholars have discovered
that culturally the images of lions and foxes were not used as we use
them: to describe crafty people, or territorial people vis; the posts.
Lions and foxes were images of comparison: between greater and lesser
powers. In calling Herod " a fox" Jesus was pointing to Herod as a
lesser man/ruler/person, incapable of carrying out his threat. Its the
equivalent of saying he was a weakling, small fry, clown or jackass.
Herod sees himself as a lion and Jesus cuts him down to size. Whatever
Herods/Pharisees plans may be these plans will fail because of God's
plan. Jesus "must" do this, he will not be a victim of violence until
he has completed what he came to do. All of us have had chicks like
this: unwanted pregnancy where we could lecture, drugs, warn of
addiction, traffic accident-irresponsibility. What Jesus offers isn't
a lecture, it's a hug. This is difficult for all of us to do, whether
were a parent, friend, colleague or even a Christian. The choice to
respond is ours. mark in Canada
Pastor Chuck
The gaffe about the two Herods was corrected in the next post.
As I was preparing last week's sermon, I looked ahead (something I
rarely do) at the lectionary for the rest of Lent and noticed that
there were characters in each lesson that we hear about in the
scriptures, especially around Easter, but we don’t really introduce to
our people. This week it is Herod. We “Bible scholars” at DPS know all
about him or do we? We’ve had a bit of discussion on “that old fox”
this week. Do our congregations know who he was beyond the fact that
he had John the Baptist killed? Do they know that Herod Antipas was
not Herod the Great? Do we just expect them to know? How about Pilate
next week and why would he “mingle” the blood of the Galileans with
their sacrifice? Who were the Pharisees and the Scribes and are they
like the older brother in the story of the prodigal son? Lastly, who
was this man Judas Iscariot? These are the men around the edges of the
Passion Story that we and our congregation love to hate and the ones
that Christ forgave saying that they didn’t understand. What do we
understand?
It is unfortunate that the story of another man is not found at all in
the common lectionary. The statement of Caiaphas that “it is better
for you that one man die for the people than the whole nation perish”
(John 11:50) seems to echo in these days of terrorism, the war in
Iraq, and the situation in the Middle East in general. Looking at the
human fear of the reaction of the Romans to the activities of the
Zealots (predominantly Galilean as in next week’s lesson with Pilate),
how would we have reacted IF we did not understand? How different are
the arguments between the Christian conservatives and liberals than
the conservative Sadducees and liberal Pharisees but how did we come
together at a common threat on 9/11?
Didn’t intend to get so long winded. Just some pondering about the
“Men Around the Edges” that I’m looking at for Lent. Any thoughts?
Mike in Soddy Daisy, TN
I am unsure if Francis is referring to my post but here are a few
references to foxes, hens (and eggs)
"....if a fox goes up on it he will break..." Neh 4:03 "...went and
caught 300 hundred foxes." Judg 15:04 "Foxes have holes, and birds of
the air.." Mt 8:02
Both Matthew and Luke record "together as a hen gathers her brood" Mt
23:37
"or if he asks for an egg, will give..." Lk 11:12 "young ones or eggs
and the mother..." Deut 22:06 "as men gather eggs that have been..."
Is 10:14
I accept many of the interpretations of "fox" that occur in other's
posts. I think Luke includes the comment to draw some attention to the
standing of Herod, in comparison to Jesus.
For me, Luke is asking the question of the reader. Who is considered
greater in the context of social opinion, (the king or the carpenter)
and yet ultimately who is it that the people can depend upon to save
them?
For me also, in this passage Jerusalem is not necessarily simply a
city, but a state of mind. An attitude. That's why Jesus states it is
impossible for a prophet to be killed outside Jerusalem. A prophet can
only be unheard in an environment of unbelief, or a misdirection of
belief. Remember that the Jewish concept of Messiah was related to a
king, who would brandish an army and set them free from their
oppresion.
Again I also point to Jesus's statement that these people were
unwilling to believe that they needed saving. The majority of people I
deal with in my ministry are exactly the same. It firstly has to be
pointed out to us, what it is we need rescuing from. We are so immune
to sin, that we don't recognise the symptoms.
I accept that metaphors and analogies can never fully describe the
true spiritual situation, but I still believe Luke recognises the
distinction between fox and hen here. The age old rivalry. Which one
ultimately is the victor? The hunter or the hunted!
Thank-you for the stimulation of your discussions, and thank-you for
the space to submit my own humble offerings.
Regards, KGB
I love the "Men on the Fringes" idea. I've been doing an Adult Sunday
School lesson on the Disciples of Jesus that was intended to last for
2 Sundays. We're going into our 5th week of it and have only covered 3
disciples so far. I would enjoy leading another study of these people
you mention in your post, the men whose names we have heard over and
over, but don't really stop to study. Thank you for the good idea. I
can see a terrific Summer Adult Ed program in this.
Just finished scaning the posts. Great work friends. Two things. First
I found the comment about the prayer shawl very interesting. Any more
thoughts on that?
Second, I have not seen Tammy post for a while, lets hold her in
prayer.
A little off title but it is my mid week lenten sermon, What things do
we do that betray Jesus today? ( Not deny but betray) Nancy-Wi
Weighing in on the"prayer, not poultry" debate. Read again Psalm 91,
last week's lectionary Psalm.
It is he who will free you from the snare/ of the fowler who seeks to
destroy you./ He will conceal you with his pinions/ and under his
wings you will find refuge. (Grail translation)
Save you from the fowler by becoming a fowl? Incarnation!!!
My sermon title (yes, it's a previously-preached one, I'm usually not
this far along on a Tuesday): Feathers or Fox Fur
kbc in sc
Let's think about this scripture politically. How is it that political
leaders rule? There are two ways that seem to rise to the top. There
are those who rule by fear and terror (the foxes) versus those who
rule by peace (the hens). If we look at our political leaders, they
tend to rule by fear and terror. We saw this in Saddam Hussein. He was
able to control the different factions in Iraq by fear. If they got
out of line, they knew he would kill them. Our own political leaders
rule the same way, only they create fear by using words. The democrats
create fear in the hearts of our senior citizens by putting out rumors
about the Republicans ending Social Security or reducing it, or
whatever they can say. A good example of how fear can be struck in the
hearts of people was Allen Greenspan's remarks before congress this
last week. The truth is the Democrats and the Republicans have been
dipping into the SS permanent funds to spend on their pork projects
for years. In spite of all that is said about being for the people,
there is a giant sucking sound coming from Washington as our concerned
politicians suck the SS Fund dry. The Republicans (of which I am one),
are just as bad. They also rule by fear saying we are at risk from
terrorists, the communists, etc. and we need to have a huge military.
My friends, it would seem the real terrorists (the foxes) are our U.S.
congress. They both claim to care about us. Ha! Bush says it is good
to have outsourcing of jobs. Kerry says it is bad, so his solution is
to give workers a 90 day notice that jobs are being outsourced. The
company is to say where the jobs are going and why. Oh, like that's a
big help! You get 90 days notice, but the jobs will still leave!
In contrast is Jesus, who rules not by fear or terror, but like a
caring hen, who wishes to gather his people under his wings. Jesus
desires we become his children, to come under the protection of his
wings. He will truly care for the people, those on the margins of
life, the disenfranchised. Jesus calls the church to minister to those
in need and to the unchurched and to bring them under God's wings of
protection. Jesus does not rule by terror or fear. Jesus rules with
peace.
The real foxes in this scripture are also the Pharisees. They are like
a political party. They are telling Jesus Herod is after him, when
they are the ones who want Jesus out of the scene. They are trying to
put fear in Him. Jesus wants none of their politics and sets his face
toward Jerusalem. He will not waver from doing God's will. He will do
the work until it is finished on the third day. PH in OH
Is it not the Transfiguration gospel this week. Could have really done
with some help on that one. Great site, though, I often pass through.
Jonno
Just a sidebar on this discussion of foxes and hens. Many people
believe that chickens are, well, "chicken." Several of my friends who
have raised chickens have told me that they can become very
aggressive, especially over a perceived threat. For instance, if one
throws a snake or ar rat into a chicken yard, the chickens will
generally tear it apart. If you like an analogy, Christ didn't just
allow himself to be killed while guarding his chicks. By dying, he
took the offensive against sin and the grave and then rose in triumph.
That's what I call aggressive. Mike in Soddy Daisy, TN
Sorry, Jonno. Transfiguration Sunday in the Common Lectionary cycle C
was February 22 and we had a good discussion. Unfortunately, it is
part of the members only area now. In cycle B (2003) it was March 2
and you may be looking at that list. If you are using the Mark account
of the Transfiguration (cycle B), check in the "2003 Lections" area in
the frame on the left of this page. It seems to be open to the public.
Mike in Soddy Daisy, TN
The following is a long post about a hen who gives her life to save
the chicks, and a chick who will not be gathered. It's an old story,
and others have heard the same story with a hailstorm as the danger.
Scroll past if you are not interested. I, however, believe the parable
has relevance, as Jesus gives his life to save ours.
Michelle
The farmyard in today's story is a rather small place, with several
kinds of animals, and a small fence that completely encircles the
barnyard. The farmer's main income comes from the fields that he
works, but he likes the various animals for both the food they provide
and the variety they add to his day apart from the long days on the
tractor.
On this farm some time ago lived a mother hen with her five chicks.
The chicks adored their mother and followed her all about the farm.
They learned to peck for food, and for gravel to help digest their
food. And the mother hen was so proud of her chicks! They were going
to grow up to be fine chickens some day, although they were still very
young.
Now the chicks were not all the same, just like you are not just the
same as any of your brothers and sisters, or exactly like your
parents. Some of the chicks would stay very close to their mother in
fear of the world while others might venture further away on their
own. One of the chicks was particularly brave, and was the first to
try everything. She was the first to practice wing flapping, and the
first to peck at the gravel, and the first to learn to run. It seemed
as if she knew everything about being a chicken, almost before she
could learn it from her mother.
The hen was very comfortable with her brood in the farmyard, and was
used to the various farm sounds and smells. It did not surprise her
when one day the old tractor was started up. It was the small gasoline
tractor that the farmer only used to move different pieces of
machinery or other things around on the farm. The mother hen liked
that sound, it reminded her of the good old days, before the big
diesel monstrosity that the farmer had recently brought in to work the
fields. Today the old tractor sounded a little different, but maybe
that was just because it had been so long since she'd last heard it.
She went on pecking at the gravel with each chick in sight as usual.
The chicks were a little surprised at the new sound, and had their
heads cocked to one side and then the other, trying to place the new
sound. Then they sniffed the air of the new gasoline smell which
replaced the diesel smell they were used to. The mother hen paid no
attention. She rather enjoyed the smell of gasoline.
Just by chance another odor reached her senses, and it was not one
that belonged. She looked toward the tractor and found that the farmer
was standing several feet away from the tractor inspecting the
contents of the wagon he was about to hitch up to the tractor. He had
not noticed the small fire which had begun in the tractor's engine.
Just as he stood up to turn toward the tractor with the wagon tongue,
the small fire exploded into a large ball of flame, igniting the grass
around the tractor and throwing the farmer against the wagon. The
situation was now quite dangerous. The brisk breeze which blew
protected the semi-conscious farmer by blowing the flames in the other
direction, but that did not help the barnyard. The flames were
steadily approaching as the mother hen gaped in fear.
Her chicks were scattering about the yard, but she gathered them
together, and told them to sit tight underneath her. This was not a
common occurrence for this time of day, and the chicks cowered in
fear. As the fire came closer, the chicks realized the danger and
scurried to find a way out of the barnyard, but the fence offered no
escape. Again the mother hen insisted that her chicks gather
underneath her, until finally they gathered in, at a loss for what to
do. But as the smoke grew thicker, and the flames grew closer, one
chick, sure that they were all going to die if they stayed where they
were, broke loose and ran for the farthest end of the barnyard,
certain that she would be the only one to survive, if only by getting
as far away from the fire as possible. The fire was raging by the time
the farmer became fully aware of what had happened. A neighbor had
seen the smoke and called in the fire squad, and they were just
arriving when the farmer scrambled to his feet and directed them to
his water supply.
When the fire was completely out, the farmer assessed the damage. The
barnyard had been completely burned over by the fire, and only the
shell remained of what had once been the barn. It appeared to be a
total loss, as noting moved in the yard once so full of life. The
farmer noticed a strange black hump over towards the far end, and went
to examine it. There, he realized that it was the mother hen, and
underneath were four very frightened chicks, dirtied with soot, but
alive.
The farmer did not even notice the small burned lump a few feet away,
but he wondered what had happened to the fifth chick, the chick who
had been the leader, the brave one, the independent one, the one who
would not be gathered.
The story of the hens, the chicks and the barnyard reminds me of a
true story about a bird that shielded her chicks at the Mt. St.Helen's
eruption. She died. The chicks lived.
West Texas Presbyterian
Interesting varitey of perspectives on the text this week. My thougths
are centering on two ideas from the text. First, the setting is
Jerusalem, literally "house of peace." With threats of murder and the
mixed political motives of the Pharisees, Jerusalem is anything but a
peaceful home for Jesus and his followers. The lament in verse 34 is a
frank expression of divine yearning and human rebellion. For Jesus,
Jerusalem has become something other than what it is intended. It is
the place for violent rejection of God's desire for reconciliation.
The second thought centers on the Lenten journey given in the Gospel
texts. Last week, Jesus went to the wilderness and experienced
temptation. This week, Jesus confronts Jerusalem and rejection.
In preaching the text, it seems logical that we 21st century followers
have to acknowlege that the world we live in is far from what God
intends. Humans have rejected the shalom of God. This fact is
painfully made in my parish as young men and women in the military are
deployed to war zones. We live in a time of heightened violence. This
text gives us a an opportunity to hear Jesus' lament and repent of the
ways our yearnings for security have torn our world and our
communities apart. Lent is a time to declare God's intention for
redemption and peace and to honestly admit how far we have fallen from
it.
These thoughts are still in process. I appreciate your inputs.
Dan in Alabama
Interesting varitey of perspectives on the text this week. My thougths
are centering on two ideas from the text. First, the setting is
Jerusalem, literally "house of peace." With threats of murder and the
mixed political motives of the Pharisees, Jerusalem is anything but a
peaceful home for Jesus and his followers. The lament in verse 34 is a
frank expression of divine yearning and human rebellion. For Jesus,
Jerusalem has become something other than what it is intended. It is
the place for violent rejection of God's desire for reconciliation.
The second thought centers on the Lenten journey given in the Gospel
texts. Last week, Jesus went to the wilderness and experienced
temptation. This week, Jesus confronts Jerusalem and rejection.
In preaching the text, it seems logical that we 21st century followers
have to acknowlege that the world we live in is far from what God
intends. Humans have rejected the shalom of God. This fact is
painfully made in my parish as young men and women in the military are
deployed to war zones. We live in a time of heightened violence. This
text gives us a an opportunity to hear Jesus' lament and repent of the
ways our yearnings for security have torn our world and our
communities apart. Lent is a time to declare God's intention for
redemption and peace and to honestly admit how far we have fallen from
it.
These thoughts are still in process. I appreciate your inputs.
Dan in Alabama
Why does Luke have Jesus offering this lament over Jerusalem *before*
he goes there? Craddock offers several possibilities, including this
one that has my attention: "By this 'premature' location of the
lament, Luke is saying there is yet time to repent, to receive pardon
for sin, and to welcome the reign of God. That offer, in fact, will
continue to be made following Jesus' death, resurrection, and
ascension, an offer not only to Jerusalem but to the entire world."
Perhaps this is a helpful direction on the Lenten journey of
repentance. I'm also struck by the image of being gathered in the
shelter of Christ's wings, as we gather around the table this Sunday
for communion.
Beginning thoughts... Leanne in AL
another week of great comments! Thanks, friends.
I have been moved by Christ's singlemindedness, and complete focus on
His calling/task. In Luke's 9th Chapter, Jesus "set his face toward
Jerusalem, " and essentially never looked back. Along the way he
heals, teaches, casts out Spirits, and, when confronted with death
threats, demonstrates that he won't be deterred.
The question I want to deal with is my (our) own tendency to become
sidetracked by one thing or another and lose my focus. Consumerism,
providing for my family, wanting to be a successful pastor, etc all
pull me this way and that. The temptations mentioned last week
sometimes slow me down to a near stop. I really want to walk
undeterred, unafraid, and untainted but I don't...I don't even come
close.
Along the way, Jesus' heart is breaking for the one's who won't be
gathered, and he is distressed that the "Holy City" will be complicit
in his own murder, yet he continues to love, heal, plead, teach, etc.
as though not a person would be lost.
I like that. It makes me cry. I challenges me to ask for strength to
stand firm in my own calling.
Haven't decided what film clip would be good with this theme. Any
suggestions? Maybe Milo and Otis? Looking for a film that depicts
singleminded purpose.
Stan in Tacoma
How's this for a title:
Running A-FOWL of Herod!! (just kidding)
Sally
Stan in Tacoma
some ideas for movie clips about single-minded purpose
"The Fellowship of the Ring" where Gandalf explains that the ring must
be destroyed in the fires of Mordor where it was forged and that it
would be a dangerous task, and Frodo Baggins steps forward and says "I
will go"
The final scene in "The Apostle" where Robert Duvall is in prison for
the murder of his wife's lover and he is leading what appears to be a
chain gang in a hymn. This might take more explaining than you want to
do, but it is really a powerful scene.
Denzel Washington in "Remember the Titans"
In "Miracle", the hockey players all give their college when asked who
they play for. But through the coach's leadership, they all come to
say "I play for team USA"
Not a movie clip, but the story of Walter Payton, who ran up and down
the same hill thousands of times in the off-season
looking at this passage and the always excellent discussion, i get not
simply a sense of movement, but of also inevitablity-almost a Walter
Cronkite reporting of "that's the way it is" and more "that's the way
it's going to be" and Jesus deep sense of regret that the people have
not responded to this message of grace that redeems and heals as
opposed to a message of power that domonates and controls. A pure
Calvinist (as opposed to an impure Calvinist like me)would see Jesus
staement as part of the inevtability of grace-no matter what we do or
don't do, God's grace will find it's way into the world.
Here in East Texas, the daffodils are blooming (2 weeks after a
snow)and the tempratures are getting warmer- asign that spring always
follows winter. I think that part of Jesus answer to the threat of
death is that he will do what needs to be done in a certian order, and
that an earthly ruler has no say in what happens next. Herod might as
well try to stop the spring flowers from blooming. As always Jesus
places himself completely in God's hands. When you do that, the Herods
of the world cannot frighten you.
But we are frightened, both by Herod and the problems that we face.
But to let go of those fears may take us into the unknown (better the
devil you know than the grace you don't?)No wonder that Jesus cries
out in anguish "Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets
and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to
gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her
wings, and you were not willing!"
How willing are we to trust only in Christ as our shelter. Scott
Krippayne has song that speaks to this "Sometimes you calm the storm,
but many times, You calm the child"
revgilmer in texarkana
Mike in Soddy Daisy, TN- your observation of the presence of key
passion story characters in the Gospel lections over the next several
weeks really sparked energy and enthusiasm in me. I, too, am going to
do a sermon series focusing in on these characters. This is a very
timely approach given all of the hooplah around the Passion movie. It
is helpful to pause a moment with each of these characters, seeking to
understand them, and perhaps considering what we might have in common
with them. Thank you for getting me out of the stuck place I have been
in with my sermon preparation all week. I have been listening in on
DPS conversations for quite some time, but this is my first posting.
Thanks for all the great food for thought. Peace, Sarah in Lowville,
NY
Stan in Tacoma,
You are thinking along the same lines I was when I chose the title
"Finishing the Work" (not the Word!) late last week. I was struck once
more by Jesus' focus on the completion of "my work" on the third day
and, meanwhile, being "on my way." I believe that Jesus turned towards
Jerusalem knowing what awaited him there, yet perhaps hoping that
there would be a change of hearts & attitudes for those who wanted his
death. Yet, even knowing that Jerusalem = danger and death he had work
to do that no one else could do.
I see so often the attitude in the church and in the world an attitude
that someone else can do the work -- or maybe that someone else can do
the work better. We (and yes I'm guilty, too) find excuses to avoid
doing the work of building up the Realm of God that God calls each of
us to do. Lent seems to be a good time to remind ourselves that we
need to re-focus our own hearts and minds so that we become less
distracted by the routines and the human needs of our lives and
remember the cost of Jesus' single-mindedness in completing his work.
Robbie in KS
Hey Sally,
Good sermon title -- you would have to be quite "plucky" to use it!
Sorry, just a "poultry" (or should that be paltry?) word from a
Northern preacher who needs to take a break from this morning's
work....
SueCan
For a sermon title this week, I am going with: A Hen in the Foxes Den.
I am going to talk about how God confronts the mighty of this world
with the meek, how Jesus returned violence with love and how we are
all called as Christians to dive into the foxes den when necessary.
Sort of a Don Quioxte jousting with windmills image. Or better yet
David and Goliath.
"Gods strength is made perfect in our weakness."
Ed in MN
I haven't posted in a while but have snuck in and out to read. I've
appreciated all the strong mother hen images--and what a great
association for Jesus to make with himself! Vulnerable to those who
would kill him, yet strong in his purpose. I've posted a children's
sermon idea that has the kids gathering under the hen's wings, made of
a big cloth.
I've been playing around with the theme of journey, based on Jesus
here and Abraham in Genesis. I'm looking at our goal, or where we're
headed, and whether we've chosen that intentionally or not. it seems
like a lot of us are either on the "comfortably numb" auto-pilot path,
or on a more flamboyant path to self-destruction. Is there something
out ahead of us that we're aiming for? Even if we don't know the
details of what it will look like, do we believe that we will get
there, by God's grace? (And I'm not talking about dying and going to
heaven!) I guess I mean all of this to talk about how the goal
transforms the journey.
I've had a harder time with this one than usual. Still just poking
around on Thursday. Sigh.
Laura in TX
I am going to tell my folks to touch someone and tell them "Prey!"
It's good advice. "Prey!" I am not referring to the verb, but the
noun. That's what they are, "Prey for someone!"
Jesus knew that we are all prey for Satan, the true ruler of this
world, and Herod the pseudo ruler of Israel. He counted himself among
the prey group.
Prey he would be.
I think Jesus calls himself the hen and Herod a fox because he knows
that the fox is out to devour the chicken. He is obvously not chicken!
And his wings will be stretched over Jerusalem on a cross. For
everyone who wants to cease being prey, they have a friend in Jesus.
With gratitude to kbc in sc I am going with a title Foxes, Friends,
and Feathers. I am going to take the line that these Pharisees were
friends and that Herod was indeed out to get Jesus. This whole season
of Lent, I am looking at the passages to note the ways that Satan
tries to lure us away from God's intentions for our lives. I am using
the image of a basketball coach who prepares his team with a scouting
report (what kind of moves did that team put over on us in the past or
on others)so that we can be prepared to counter his moves. rather like
C S Lewis in Screwtape Letters. This is more timely for Baptists in NC
who know little about Lent but everything about March Madness. The
ploys that I see in this passage is the fear of the fox (real or
imagined), the false directions of well meaning friends, and the
flittering away of life further and further from the protective
feathers of God's good intent while the hawk is circling the barnyard.
Would like some comment on "it is impossible for a prophet to be
killed outside of Jerusalem." jrbnrnc
