Scripture Text (NRSV)
Luke 10:1-11, 16-20
10:1 After this the Lord appointed seventy others and sent them on
ahead of him in pairs to every town and place where he himself
intended to go.
10:2 He said to them, "The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers
are few; therefore ask the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers
into his harvest.
10:3 Go on your way. See, I am sending you out like lambs into the
midst of wolves.
10:4 Carry no purse, no bag, no sandals; and greet no one on the
road.
10:5 Whatever house you enter, first say, 'Peace to this house!'
10:6 And if anyone is there who shares in peace, your peace will
rest on that person; but if not, it will return to you.
10:7 Remain in the same house, eating and drinking whatever they
provide, for the laborer deserves to be paid. Do not move about from
house to house.
10:8 Whenever you enter a town and its people welcome you, eat what
is set before you;
10:9 cure the sick who are there, and say to them, 'The kingdom of
God has come near to you.'
10:10 But whenever you enter a town and they do not welcome you, go
out into its streets and say,
10:11 'Even the dust of your town that clings to our feet, we wipe
off in protest against you. Yet know this: the kingdom of God has come
near.'
10:16 "Whoever listens to you listens to me, and whoever rejects
you rejects me, and whoever rejects me rejects the one who sent me."
10:17 The seventy returned with joy, saying, "Lord, in your name
even the demons submit to us!"
10:18 He said to them, "I watched Satan fall from heaven like a
flash of lightning.
10:19 See, I have given you authority to tread on snakes and
scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy; and nothing will hurt
you.
10:20 Nevertheless, do not rejoice at this, that the spirits
submit to you, but rejoice that your names are written in heaven."
Comments:
How are we to weave into these readings the proclamation of
Independence Day? What doe our people need to hear from us in this
post 9/11 America? One thing that must be said today that it is time
that as citizens of this great land we must begin listening to one
another again, to seek to rediscover the common good, without fighting
among ourselves. The Religious Right have done a number on our country
we need to find a way to reclaim it for the "center" which needs to be
affirmed and upheld by the Gospel.
tom in ga
Jesus commissions his followers to go where he would go and do what he
would do. Risking hardship and danger, they offer peace and healing as
signs that the reign of God is near.
Much of the time the disciples tended to get things wrong, as when
James and John wanted to bring down fire on a Samaritan village. But
there were occasions when they seemed to get it right. When seventy
selected followers went out in pairs against all odds, they returned
astonished. They discovered that even the demons submitted to them.
Jesus had told them how tough their mission could be. Yet when they
returned, they came back with a glowing report.
Even when they managed to get it right, though, they still didn't get
it entirely right. In this case Jesus affirmed what they had seen and
done, and then he raised the ante. He indicated they would have the
kind of authority that would allow them to tread on snakes and
scorpions. Yet, he cautioned, they were not to be taken in by the
special effects. Rather than being impressed with having power over
the enemy on earth, they were to rejoice in their abiding relationship
with their Father in heaven.
All who have been baptized in the name of the triune God are called
and sent on some form of mission. Wherever they serve, many may feel
unwelcome like sheep among wolves. On the other hand, some may
experience the rare sight of watching Satan fall from heaven like a
flash of lightning. Jesus seems to indicate that neither the struggle
nor the achievement is the point of discipleship. The Lord of the
harvest calls followers not to success but to faithfulness. What
counts is not the spectacle nor our feelings. The abiding significance
in serving Christ resides in the relationship with God. In the end,
Jesus will call us to remember that we rejoice not over the spirits
who submit but over the fact that our names are written in heaven.
Although Moses' choice of seventy elders to be his helpers (Num
11.16-25) may be in Luke's mind, more likely the stronger influence is
the report of seventy nations in Genesis 10 (seventy in the Hebrew
text, seventy-two in the Greek). After all, Luke is anticipating the
mission to the nations begun at Pentecost after Easter when persons
gathered "from every nation under heaven" (Acts 2.5). In fact,
Gentiles may already be in mind in the instruction, "Eat what is set
before you." Food was a critical issue in the spread of the gospel
(Acts 11.1-18; Gal 2.11-21). The practice of sending messengers in
teams of two into places where Jesus was to come began when Jesus
first turned toward Jerusalem (9.51-52), continues here, and will
appear again at Jesus' entry into Jerusalem (19.28-34). Running ahead
to announce Christ's coming not only implies preparation but gives to
the mission a magisterial or regal tone. But just as strong or even
stronger is the eschatological flavor of the passage. Note the analogy
of harvest time (end time), the instruction to travel light, and the
command to take no time for social amenities (v. 4 may echo 2 Kings
4.29). Working under the shadow of the eschaton is certainly in
keeping with the mood of intense single-mindedness set in 9.51-62.
The missionaries were to depend entirely on the hospitality of their
hosts, very likely a practice common among early Christian groups,
including missions of Paul and his associates. There was to be no
shopping about for the best room and board (v.7), nor were the
missionaries to pronounce doom on those who refused hospitality. Jesus
had been rejected in a Samaritan village, but no fire was called down;
Jesus moved on to other villages (9.52-56). Rituals of departure were
to be brief, leaving such persons to be judged by what they had
missed--that is, the kingdom of God had been near (vv.10-11). There
will be a judgment, but that is a word Jesus will speak. Notice that
verse 12 is Jesus' word to the missionaries and is not a part of their
message. Preachers are not authorized to judge. Notice also that the
message to those who accept and to those who reject is the same: "The
kingdom of God has come near" (vv.9, 11). The preachers were not to
wait to see how they would be treated before preparing their sermons.
Relevance is, of course, important in preaching, but the basic message
is not contingent on the response.
The return of the Seventy with reports of success prompts from Jesus a
revelatory discourse that continues into the prayer of thanks in
verses 21-22. In fact, Luke seems to contrast deliberately the
rejoicing of the Seventy and the rejoicing of Jesus; they rejoice in
their success, Jesus rejoices in the Holy Spirit (v.21). Our text,
then, seems to lie at the border between concealment (the disciples do
not yet understand, but they will when it is revealed to them, 24.16,
31-32, 45) and revelation which Jesus experiences in the Holy Spirit.
The report of the Seventy centers entirely on exorcisms even though
there is no mention of casting out demons in their instructions
(vv.1-12). The focus, then, is on the evidence of Jesus gaining power
over the forces of evil. In response to their report, Jesus shares his
revelatory vision which is cast in apocalyptic terms familiar to us
from Revelation. That Satan first dwelt in heaven is stated elsewhere
(Job 1.6; 2.1; Jn 12.31; Rev 12.7), and Luke's description of his fall
is probably based on Isa 14.12-15. Ps 91.13 lies back of the promise
that the righteous shall be immune to and will triumph over evil and
antagonistic forces.
However, a central question is whether Jesus' vision is descriptive of
what has happened in this successful mission or of what will happen
when the disciples have their eyes opened (24.31), receive the Holy
Spirit which now resides in Jesus (Acts 1.5, 8), and move Jesus'
mission into the whole world (Acts 1.8). No doubt, the successful
mission of the Seventy prompts this reply of Jesus, but it is not a
reply confined to their mission. Notice the mixing of tenses: "The
demons ARE subject to us" (present); "I SAW [literally, was seeing]
Satan fall" (continuing past); and "Nothing SHALL hurt you" (future).
That which has been and is taking place in Jesus' ministry and theirs
will move to its completion in the future. As he so often does, Luke
is undoubtedly here thinking of the mission of the church following
the empowering of the Holy Spirit. There was exorcising of demons
(Acts 8.7), the rooting out of Satan's work within the membership
(Acts 5.3), the power of the Spirit over Simon the magician (Acts
8.18-24), the punishment of Herod Agrippa who laid violent hands on
the church (Acts 12.20-24), the defeat of the false prophet Elymas by
Paul (Acts 13.4-12), and even an immunity to the strike of a serpent
(Acts 28.3-6). Jesus' vision does not, therefore, make too much or too
little of the success of the Seventy but rather sets it into the
larger frame of God's reign.
However, Jesus does warn the Seventy that triumphalism is an
inappropriate spirit among disciples. Our chief joy should be, not
that we have certain gifts and powers, but that God has received and
accepted us, that our names are "written in heaven" (Dan 12.1; Phil
4.3; Rev 3.5; 13.8; 20.15). This sobering reminder recalls Jesus' word
reported in Matthew: "On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord,
did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name,
and do many mighty works in your name?' And then I will declare to
them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers'" (Mt 7.22-23).
tom in ga,
I, too, am wondering how it might be possible to tie in Independence
Day themes with this passage. I'm not sure it is possible. If my
message focuses on our country's birth, it will certainly be my goal
to point people to look beyond the concerns of our country to concerns
that affect the global community. I am glad I'm an American, but I am
concerned with the kind of Patriotism that pits "us" against "them."
If any one has some good inspiration for this day, I'm anxious to hear
it. On the other hand, this scripture passage is a great one, too. It
just doesn't seem to fit well with the 4th of July. Oh well, I do have
almost 2 weeks. I pray for guidance! And I look forward to the dialog.
Mel in NE
Ooops! That should have said, "I am concerned ABOUT the kind of
Patriotism that pits "us" against "them."
Mel in NE
Just in case any one is wondering, the unsigned posts dated
6/16/04,11:31AM and 11:46AM come from Interpretation:Luke by Fred
Craddock, JohnKnoxPress, 1990. I thought the words seemed very
familiar, I had just read them in Craddock's book!
I'm not sure why, week after week, some unsigned "scholar" insists on
quoting sources with out giving credit. I'm not sure it's even legal!
Mel in NE
Most of the passages for this Sunday refer to healing. The Naaman
story is about the healing of an individual, the Galations passage
about healing within the church fellowship, and the Luke passage about
taking the work of healing to the world. I think it is very possible
to tie the message of healing and reconciliation to July 4, which in
my denomination we call "Christian Citizenship Sunday." All the
passages present a message that is very far from the path our country
is currently taking. The world may be hostile, but we are to be
peace-bringers, reconcilers, servants. JJ in KS
This reading just happens to fall on July 4 this year but it can fall
anywhere from July 3 to July 9 depending on the year. Just because a
national holiday happens to fall on a Sunday doesn't mean that the
worship service and the sermon need to or should have anything to do
with Independence Day. It's the Fifth Sunday after Pentecost
everywhere else.
Just a word in response to the unsigned post: I agree in part with
you, that this Sunday is the 5th Sunday after Pentecost, and that
should be our focus. Normally, I do not pay much attention to state
holidays, believing that focusing on things like Memorial Day, 4th of
July, etc. has no real revelence to our faith.
This year, I feel differently, however. An important part of our
preaching is meeting people where they are. The congregation in which
I serve is very much interested and concerned about in what is going
on in our world. For me, the 4th of July is a good day to address some
of that. JJ in KS has pointed out that the passages for this day are
about healing. Perhaps, it will all work together. My goal is to get
people thinking about being a part of the solution of peace in our
troubled world; because when we cease feeling helpless, hope is
created. If I find that I must depart from the lectionary, I will do
that.
God bless,
Mel in NE
I'm developing a new and different idea for Independence Sunday which
may be worth sharing. I have asked four lay people to prepare a 3 to 5
minute talk on "God's Challenge to Americans". I've asked a 3rd
grader, an Eagle Scout (teen-ager), a middle-age female who is known
to be liberal in thought, and a older male who is known to be
conservative. I'll say a brief word about diversity of opinion, and
unity in our mission to love God and serve our nation....which will
link with this text... God gave me this idea while mowing lawn last
night and now I am excited to see where the Spirit will lead.
Iowa Starry
Mel in GA,
Your "concern about Patriotism" comment reminded me of a quote that I
came across recently on another website (stop-the-hate.org), which I
hope was attributed correctly. Perhaps you may find it interesting:
"Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism,
when hate for people other than your own comes first." - Charles
DeGaulle
Steve in TX
Steve in TX, Love the quote about patriotism vs. nationalism. Thanks!
Mel in NE
A lot of times we get caught up in the special effects of life. Both
in this selection and the 2Kings selection the characteers get lost in
the special effects and forget the true reason for thier journeys.
Great movies aren't made with great special effects. The movies that
you watch over and over again are those with a story and a meaning,
the movies that touch you somehow.
Big T in Texas
Oil, let me save you the trouble:
From the Well Oiled Version of the Bible:
Luke 10:1-11, 16-20
10:1 After this the Lord IN LOVE appointed seventy others IN LOVE and
sent them IN LOVE on ahead of him in pairs IN LOVE to every town IN
LOVE and place IN LOVE where he himself IN LOVE intended to go.
10:2 He said to them IN LOVE, "The harvest IN LOVE is plentiful IN
LOVE, but the laborers IN HATE of work are few IN LOVE; therefore ask
the Lord of the harvest IN LOVE to send out laborers IN LOVE into his
harvest.
10:3 Go on your way IN LOVE. See, I am sending you out like lambs IN
LOVE into the midst of wolves.
10:4 IN LOVE Carry no purse, no bag, no sandals; and IN LOVE greet no
one IN LOVE on the road.
10:5 Whatever house you enter, first say IN LOVE, 'Peace to this
house!'
I concur with the concerns over too much of "patriotism" in the United
States at this time, however let's not be opposed to patriotism
either. People mock at patriots and wonder why there are traitors. No,
I'm not calling for us to wear red, white, and blue robes, but let's
not be anti-patriotic either.
My first thought here is the proclamation of God's Kingdom - a kingdom
which is not of this world (John 18:36).
Waiting for more of your thoughts.
JG in WI
It's Sunday afternoon and I'm getting ready to go camping, so I
thought I'd get a little bit of a start on this Sunday's sermon (next
Sunday's sermon)... anyways I wanted to say thank you all for your
help and support while I went through my "funk" last week. I ended up
preaching something very different from what I'd posted... but special
thanks to those who kept me accountable to loving God's people. I
managed to point towards the positive, after all! Without harping on
criticisms ... I couldn't have done it without your help. God bless
everyone here!
Sally in GA
Rejoice not that the demons (or Al Qaeda or Saddam Hussein) submit to
you but that your name is written in Heaven.
Just to chime in on the patriotism/nationalism angle: I like the idea
of our ultimate citizenship not being in America or any other country
(dovetails what I preached today about Jesus calling us to change our
focus from earth towards heaven - Jerusalem). True rejoicing isn't
over "winning" but rather the freeing release of bondage to earth and
earthly concerns.
Like the saying "winning the battle but losing the war." I'd rather
lose the battles and win the war - the war over evil, that is!
OK, stretching it a bit, I'll admit. This will be Part II of my "A New
Path" series.
Sally in gA
I do a 4th of July service every year, and do it without apology. I
believe God established this nation and put great expectations on it.
Much like Israel, I guess. Just as Israel could not imagine itself
apart from God's influence and leadership, so I want this congregation
to remember that God is our true Head. The 4th of July is the perfect
day for that theme, and to celebrate our nation's connection with and
responsibility to God.
Now to find the Scripture for this year's service. I don't think this
one's it.
KHC
One thing that makes this July 4th different from other July 4th's is
that this July 4th sees an Iraqi government declaring independence
from the United States. <P> In 1776, representatives of thirteen
colonies declared their independence from England, not the end of the
fighting (that had only begun!) The fighting in Iraq will not end on
July 1st either. <P> The Continental Congress sent messengers out, to
carry copies of the Declaration of Independence throughout the
colonies. <P> Jesus sent out messengers to proclaim that the Kingdom
of God was near. (Not that it had arrived, but that it was near.) <P>
One Tom
This is the first July 4th in history to have the flag at half-mast.
Hmmmmm. weaving madly the threads from scripture to life to scripture
to life to scripture.
Storyteller
As far as the fourth of July link, people lost their lives so that we
may study theses scripture, practice and worship what the Seventy
people started. Both the United States and Christ are about freedom
coupled together with responsibility to these freedoms!
Storyteller -
My understanding is that the flag will be returned to full staff for
July 4th.
JG in WI
KHC -- I'm uncomfortable with a statement like "God established this
country." I, for one, don't believe that for a minute. I believe that
honorable men and women, some of them Christians, established this
country, and we should certainly pray for its protection under God's
grace (as we should for all countries). But when it comes to
establishing national boundaries and sovereignties, a statement like
"God established this country" strikes me as equivalent to something
like Charles the First's insistence on "the divine right of kings" or
German army's belt buckles inscribed with "Gott mit uns". When it
comes to nation states, I believe the words of St. Peter in the Book
of Acts apply, "God shows no partiality."
Aside from that disagreement over the relationship between the
creation of the US and God.... I, too, offer a service of thanksgiving
on July 4 and this year, on this Sunday, will stray from the
Eucharistic Lectionary to use the propers set out in the Book of
Common Prayer (ECUSA, 1979) for Independence Day -- you might consider
taking a look at those in your quest for Scriptures for the day:
Deuteronomy 10:17-21; Psalm 145 or 145:1-9; Hebrews 11:8-16; Matthew
5:43-48.
Blessings, Eric in OH
Speaking of flags at half-mast ... just how long is it supposed to be
that way, anyway???? It wasn't this long for the NASA astronauts or
the WTC or Oklahoma victims!!!
A bewildered blonde
v. 18 ... "I watched Satan fall from heaven ..."
Curious on y'all's different "takes' on this. Like, when Satan fell
(long ago, or when demons were submitting to the disciples), and why
it gives disciples authority to tread on snakes ...
But, that's really more idle curiosity - I'm convinced that the main
point is in v. 20 - rejoice not in your victory but in your submission
to the Lord of love. That said ...
My younger daughter has been going through a phase for a little more
than a week now, where she's kept awake at night because she keeps
imagining that there are snakes in her room. (and let's not go into
Freud - she's at the right age to be resolving the Elektra complex)
... Anyways, it makes me ponder 2 things: 1) our confidence in our
authority to tread on snakes and have nothing hurt us, and 2) our
imagining that things will hurt us that are not a real threat - in her
case, imaginary snakes.
Sally in GA
A few scattered musings for early in the week: A key part of the
context is that Jesus is sending out laborers for the harvest. The
goal would seem to be collecting as much fruit or harvest as possible.
And, yet, the amount of growth or fruit or harvest is not our
responsibility or role. Growth is God's role. Our role is to be
messengers, in both word and deed. God's grace stands out, above and
beyond any earthly victories.
If we get caught up in our own need to be loved, we will be very
concerned about how people respond to the message. But it is not about
us being accepted by those to whom we are speaking. It is about being
where God wants us and doing what God commands us.
Throughout Scripture, God seems to go where there is receptivity. And,
likewise, there is the call to shake the dust off of the feet where
there is no receptivity. In counseling terms, we might say God knows
how to "detach with love".
It seems to me that when our patriotism gets wrapped in our personal
immaturity, we get caught up in winning and losing. When we are able
to "detach with love" we can focus on the health of all people,
whether they respond to us well or not. We should desire that all
people find spiritual, physical and emotional health and freedom, that
all receive of God's grace.
I passed a Friends Meeting House recently and saw a sign proclaiming,
"Peace is Patriotic". It made me realize that indeed, even in war, we
are fighting for peace. Too many times we lose the ends in the means.
Is this a sign of our own addiction, thinking crisis is normal? I see
a lot of families like that, who create crisis so they can let out the
feelings that they repress day in and day out. War is not the ultimate
answer no matter what camp or community one finds one's self in. It
always takes place as a means to an end. And if peace is not the
outcome of whatever method, then perhaps we need to change the method.
My sermon focus is "Seeking God's Grace in Freedom" using this text
and the Naaman story from II Kings. I have no problem giving credit to
those who have served and continue to serve in self-sacrificing ways.
They are a good example of "laying down one's life for a friend." But,
if we think we are bringing this freedom through our own work's
righteousness without the grace of God, we are treading in very
dangerous waters. (In which case, we should go for a dip with Namaan.)
There needs to be an understanding that our role is subservient to
that of God. Our identity should not be based on what we have done or
what authority we have, but because we are loved by an incredible God.
Pride in who we are as children of God can be a good thing. Pride
because we think we are the better than another can be a dangeous
thing. Israel was blessed to be a blessing. It is significant that
they lost wars and were sent into exile more than once because of
forgetting their part of the covenant, for being unfaithful. Lots of
stuff to be "unpacked" here.
The principle for me is not who is against who in the physical realm.
This thinking tends to make us see the "evil" in the other without
taking care of the "log in our own eye." Rather, I always ask, is each
party (especially me) being faithful to where God has placed them, be
they Christian, Muslim or Jewish or other. It is not about them and
me...it is about each of us before God. I see my job as introducing
people to God and to model a faithful lifestyle, the rest is God's
job. My word is never as effective as God's Word, yet my actions can
have a transforming affect if I submit to God's will.
Thanks for letting me think out loud....
Grace and peace, Prophet in PA
Verse 1 reminded me so much of last week's rejection from the
Samaritan town. Apparently one rejection was not enough to derail
God's plan. Jesus' ministry now grew to at least 70 men "on staff"
(that's a lot, even for most of us today). No wonder He said, "The
harvest is plentiful". However, even with 70 missionary on hand, Jesus
still wanted more, "the laborers are few". His vision is bigger (I
would simply be contented to have that many people serving in the
church). Why is that? It's because my vision was limited to the
church, while His vision is on the World. Jesus also taught me here to
link vision to prayer, "ask the Lord of the harvest to send out
laborers into his harvest". I must admit that my mental attitude is
mostly "Make do with what you have" rather than "Send more labors".
Send more labors for what? So that they would become victims and be
eaten alive as "lambs into the midst of wolves"? Exactly! If Jesus
embraced His cross in Jerusalem, wouldn't His followers supposed to
embrace the same upside-down call of redemption? No wonder he demanded
so much commitment in last week text.
As they embark on this mission, Jesus wanted them to depend on God
more than the planning and resources of their own Mission Board (v.
4-6). They were to build relationship (by staying at the same house),
minister to the people and proclaim the Gospel. In the face of
rejection, they will still proclaim the Gospel ("The Kingdom of God is
near") but they just won't stay and minister. Hhm, I think we often do
it backward today (minister to people no matter what, but reluctant to
proclaim the KoG).
They returned (and didn't get eaten by the wolfs) and were excited to
experience supernatural victories. Jesus assured them of the final
victory at the end too, but that's not important. What important is
the reconciliation of human unto God (for if victory were God's main
concern, He could take care of it without even involve the human.)
Dear God, please open up my vision and help me to see what you see.
Help me to advance Your Kingdom, beyond the logistic difficulties,
beyond the humanistic distraction, and beyond supernatural opposition.
Coho, Midway City.
Thanks for the clarification JG Storyteller
A bewildered blonde asked about flying the flag at half-staff....
The display of the US flag is governed by regulations published in
Chapter 10 of Title 36 of the U.S. Code. With respect to lowering the
flag in memorial, it says in part:
On Memorial Day the flag should be displayed at half-staff until noon
only, then raised to the top of the staff. By order of the President,
the flag shall be flown at half-staff upon the death of principal
figures of the United States Government and the Governor of a State,
territory, or possession, as a mark of respect to their memory. In the
event of the death of other officials or foreign dignitaries, the flag
is to be displayed at half-staff according to Presidential
instructions or orders, or in accordance with recognized customs or
practices not inconsistent with law. In the event of the death of a
present or former official of the government of any State, territory,
or possession of the United States, the Governor of that State,
territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be
flown at half-staff.
The flag shall be flown at half-staff thirty days from the death of
the President or a former President; ten days from the death of the
Vice President, the Chief Justice or a retired Chief Justice of the
United States, or the Speaker of the House of Representatives; from
the day of death until internment of an Associate Justice of the
Supreme Court, a Secretary of an executive or military department, a
former Vice President, or the Governor of a State, territory, or
possession; and on the day of death and the following day for a Member
of Congress. The flag shall be flown at half-staff on Peace Officers
Memorial Day, unless that day is also Armed Forces Day.
=================
When the flag was flown at half-staff for the OKC bombing victims, the
9/11 dead, or the deceased astronauts, it was by presidential order
which also stated the time (a week in each case, I believe). When it
is lowered for a deceased president, the time of display is governed
by the Code quoted above, which requires a one-month period.
Blessings, Eric in OH
Salley in GA writes:
Rejoice not that the demons (or Al Qaeda or Saddam Hussein) submit to
you but that your name is written in Heaven.
I would add G W Bush and Cheney to that list. Think about it, what of
their actions since taking office would even be remotely endorsed and
a Jewsih prophet that made this remark and then later hung on a
tree-nailed there by the occupying world power.
KCH
LOL, did God send us to slaughter the native Americans and take their
land?
You are surely no prophet with a word of truth.
Just to add to Eric's correct citation of the 30-day half-mast rule:
the President can order that, over-riding the rule, the flag may be
raised for the 4th. So far, there is no indication that GWB is
considering this, but I can certainly imagine that he might.
Also, thanks, Eric for the ECUSA readings for the 4th. The UMC Book of
Worship suggests: Deut. 10: 12-13, 17-21; Psalm 72, Galatians 5:
13-26, and John 8:31-36.
Best to all, Chris in Niagara
Tom in ga and mel,
This is perfect for the 4th:
Just as the 70 needed the Birth of Love to really do the right thing
in the right attitude of Love for both friends and foes,
so too do we in the good ole US of A AND THE US of A need THE Birth of
Love now all these years after the Birth of Life in ourselves and OF
our nation
so we too can have the peace of love with our friends and family, and
fight in Love and with Love our foes in war and so make em our
friends! psalms 110:1
Trying to be a Boil: a Beloved One In Love.
KHC,
Don't you want your congregation to remember that God is our true Head
by the Love he has for himself as our Head AND as our Foot so he can
love us as his footstool, pslams 110:1, and as his head when he
re-binds whatever we bind? matthew 16:18-19, ephesians 5 and john 13
and 1 corin 9:18-22.
The 4th of July, the birth of our nation, is the perfect day for the
theme of the Birth of Love for both friends and family AND for foes
and stangers, for both our nation and for all others, Levit 19,
so that we remember and re-celebrate and recreate in even more perfect
Love our nation's connection of Love with and responsibility of Love
to God.
After all, it is only in Love that our motto makes perfect sense:
For only in Love is it
One for all and all for one,
and only
out of One Love comes many,
and out of many and all in Love comes One ...Love.
coil: connecting omni in love
Hey,
Just saw this!
What a great job! smile
Imitation is what? smile
Now if only i had seen this before i wrote mine,...! smile
Now if only you had signed! But I love u as unsigned! anyway!
Now as you in Love of course compare yours with mine, you will see
that based on the context, most of the 70 were NOT in 100% Love: so
you wd have to tAILor your in Love's to suit. And the whole point is
to lvoe those who do not greet you: so since most people hate thsoe
who are ungreetful, the laborers in hate are many! see?
What do you think?
Hey, I am serious: you are on to it. At least i hope so!
Please tell me where you think I am wrong. Okay?
Thank you in Love.
Foil: Foiled One in Love By One who is obviously also in Love: Ail!!
"Oil, let me save you the trouble:
From the Well Oiled Version of the Bible:"
The New Colussus
"Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame, With conquering limbs
astride from land to land, Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall
stand
"A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame Is the imprisoned lightning,
and her name Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand Glows world-wide
welcome; her mild eyes command The air-bridged harbor that twin cities
frame.
"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she With silent lips.
"Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to
breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these,
the homeless, tempest-tost to me, I lift my lamp beside the goden
door!"
The inscription of the Staute of Liberty bears little likeness to our
current state of the union. What's to celebrate?
Pr.del in Ia
Sally in ga,
Please just ask her: Does she love snakes?
If she hates em, that's why she is thinking of them in hate of
thinking of them!
Since our brains work by words, if you tell her to NOT think about
snakes, what does she have to think about in order to not think about
snakes? see? Snakes, of course! So she can not get rid of the word she
hates without getting rid of her brain!
So God's only solution is to love all words, or in her case, to start
to love all the words she hates! And then she will calm down by loving
what she is thinking of and by realising that who she loves is also
represented by a snake she hates!! John 3:13-16.
That is exactly how it works with Satan: in Love for him, he will flee
from us or be of no acount or fear when we do think of him or even if
we think of him all the time!
Try it. please!
God loves snakes and worms; he made them! Proverbs 30:19.
God and JC are represented by snakes: numbers 21 and john 3: 14-15: so
we can''t hate satan or snakes without hating jesus! see?
Plus, how can we be as wise as serpents if we hate ourselves as
snakes? matthew 10:15.
'My younger daughter has been going through a phase for a little more
than a week now, where she's kept awake at night because she keeps
imagining that there are snakes in her room.'
Until I was 37 I had to look under my bed for snakes before I got in
bed out of hate and fer of snakes! I had been taught to hate them all
my life till then! And then hate of satan, that old snake of rev 12:9,
my hate was compounded: I cd not even look at them on tv, and like
your dtr I thot I was going crazy because i thot of him all the time!
It was my hate for satan and snakes or any word that was the really
crazy idea! Since then I fall asleep in Love in 5 minutes! smile she
will also tend to hate falling and so to dream in Hate that she is
falling, and will in fact fall in hate rather than fall in Love!
smile!
'Anyways, it makes me ponder 2 things: 1) our confidence in our
authority to tread on snakes and have nothing hurt us,'
it has to be done in love of snakes and in Love of hurts!
Snake-handlers in zoos do it all the time: IN LOVE!
'and 2) our imagining that things will hurt us that are not a real
threat - in her case, imaginary snakes.'
But in her brain they ARE REAL! The inner reality in our brains is the
real reality since it is that inner reality that makes sense of all in
OUTER reality! When we use our inner reality as our reference reality,
outer reality is virtual reality! But when we make our outer reality
our referential reality, that makes our inner reality our vitual or
imaginary reality, and then we treat is as if it were not real! It is
MORE real that our outer reality!
And our inner reality works by words! And Love is the master word
because it simply loves all words! And all words ahve images: That is
why God says to lovoe all pairs of words! matthew 22:36-40; 5:43-48.
So the more words she lvoes, the greater will be her imagination and
she will love what she imagines just as she did as a kid! hatred for
teh word snakes or for any word is blocking her imagination form doing
its God-made natural thing! that is why it is a sin to hate any word!
see? as soon as you explain this to her, that it is NOT a sin to THINK
of snakes, and she is supposed to lvoe all words, including snakes,
and that it IS THE sin of hate any word, romans 8:35-39, she will sigh
as if a big weight has been lifted off of her: that wd be the weight
of hate In her mind!, and her sleep will be sweet! proverbs 3:24-25.
Nightmares are simply dreams about what words and inages we
hate!daniel 2:1. So she must be having thsoe too.
Sweet dreams are simply night mares [horse of the night!] about what
we love!dan 2:17-23.
So the more words she loves herslef as, the greater her imagination
will be which imagination wuill make her Love even more, the more good
sleep she will ahve, and she will lvoe all of who or what she imagines
to be in her room, and she will be in God and God in her! 1 john 4:16.
Result/ NO fear she hates! 1 john 4:18
hope that helps.
soil: some one in Love
I can't take credit for this, but it appears to be almost a sermon in
itself. It's from G. Campbell Morgan.
10:2 - "The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few; therefore
ask the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into his harvest."
Jesus speaks of the harvest two other times.
The first time, He is among the DESPISED Samaritans. (John 4:35-38)
The second time, He is among the DISTRESSED Galileans. (Matthew
9:35-38)
This time, He is among the DISINTERESTED people of Perea.
Morgan makes the marvelous point that where most of us might see
obstacles, Jesus sees opportunities. We may see hinderances, but Jesus
sees the harvest.
JG in WI
Tom in GA,
Treading snakes and scorpions, I bet some Rush Limbough type of
preacher will use it to say, BOMB IRAQ, or some facsimile.
Strength to tread Scorpions and Snakes...LOL Bush and Kerry and the
running mates.... My Question is Kerry the Snake or the Scorpion?
ROTFL
Mel in NE, Fred Craddock is a disgruntled American pastor who went to
Canada to preach....I have his book on Preaching...I did not like it,
neither did my classmates, that book is a crock!
Bewildered Blonde, THe half mast thing is supposed to be 30 days! I
was told that by miltitary people in MY Church
Clerically Blonde in west ohio
after last sunday when the disciples nearly shocked and awed a
samaritan village, it seems to me Jesus gives those he sends ahead of
him a short course on Evangelism Manners 101.
Folks, if people dont want to hear what you are preaching (main point
being the kingdom of God has come near you) or have anything to do
with you, LEAVE. Dont nuke anybody with fire either from heaven or
with fiery words of anger and hate. Just leave and take nothing of
theirs with you. Not even the dust on you sandles (i know all about
shaking dust being something to do with symbolically cussing 'em out
... i dont buy it)
Jesus is teaching them to be like him. He does not let power over
demons go to his head. He stays focussed on what real reward is: to
have your name written in heaven.
Still reading the text for itself ... Story teller
I've only read a little bit, but I've noted the concern about July 4.
Yesterday our Epistle text dealt with freedom, and our congregation
was celebrating Juneteenth, so I feel like we've covered that aspect.
We'll be celebrating the 4th with fireworks and desserts in the
evening. I know that our worship leader and elders will be likely to
work the 4th into their stuff, so I'm going to leave it alone, except
in the pastoral prayer.
Now, what to preach about this text?!! I have no idea. But I've always
been captivated by the idea that Jesus basically says, "if they're not
receptive, don't waste your time." Is is worth asking where and how we
are wasting our time?
Pam in San Bernardino
Clerically Blonde: I don't know where you got your information about
Fred Craddock. However, I would not call him "disgruntled," nor is he
in Canada. He is the pastor of Cherry Log Christian Church (Disciples
of Christ) in Cherry Log, Georgia. He is also Bandy Distinguished
Professor of Preaching and New Testament, Emeritus, in the Candler
School of Theology, Emory University.
Also, Kerry is neither snake nor scorpion.... although he might tread
on one....
Blessings, Eric in OH
Just to muddy the waters a little further...will anyone be singing
"patriotic" hymns/songs during worship? I don't like using patriotic
music in worship and the folks have been complaining, although not to
me. We have communion this Sunday and I won't incorporate patriotic
music until after the benediction has been pronounced. We will sing
"This is My Song," however. KC
KC asked, "will anyone be singing "patriotic" hymns/songs during
worship?" We'll be singing the National Hymn (not the National Anthem)
and "God Bless our Native Land" (same tune as "My Country 'Tis of
Thee"). I have no problem singing this hymns at any time, nor do I
have a problem singing them at a communion service (a twice-weekly
event in our Episcopal Parish). They are sing the praise of God and
request God's blessing -- as opposed to songs which sing the praise of
the country and extol its virtues.
Blessings, Eric in OH
I'm struggling with the talk of patriotism, although I realize that
the context of our preaching this weekend (I'll be preaching Saturday
and Sunday)is in the midst of a patriotic fervor in our country and we
would be foolish to ignore that context in our preaching. That said,
where does God call us as Christians to be patriotic? If patriotism,
as Charles DeGaul would say is love of our own people first; that
sounds wonderful but as Christians aren't we called to love all of
God's children (no matter what country they live in - even in Iraq,
Iran and Palestine!), not just those in our own country? Are we to
love one group first? just thoughts as I continue to struggle with the
place of patriotism in the church; I'm not so sure it belongs there;
but reality is that for most of hte people we will preach to this
weekend, patriotism is here esp when July 4th happens to fall on the
5th Sunday of Pentecost. LCShelly in VT
I happen to be preaching this Sunday, and have decided what my sermon
will be: "God Dependent" I want to be independent, and interdependent,
but I must be God dependent in order to truly be the other two. This
sermon is based on the Galatian passage. However in the third section,
I will refer to the Gospel lesson dealing with Jesus direction to the
70; the pairs were going out not for themselves, but for Jesus. This
brings to my mind the question, In thinking about the songs and
liturgy for Sunday's service, What would Jesus want us to do in this
21st Century?
Shalom
bammamma
I think that what you mean is:
Yeah, I think I allow all the LOVE and opposites talk I get from Oil
to put some of me in the bad humor of Hate for myself as some
enemy-opposite words.
No one can nor no thing can get you in a bad attitude without your own
consent. Eleanor Roosevelt
Re: the singing of patriotic hymns -- our (Episcopal) hymnal offers
several which would be considered "patriotic" ("God bless our Native
Land", "O Beautiful", etc.). We are also blessed with two alternative
hymnals, one of which, "Lift Every Voice and Sing II" offers the hymn
of the same name (often referred to as the African American National
Anthem) as its first listing. I intend to use both "Lift Every
Voice..." and a "patriotic" hymn from the 1982 hymnal as a reminder
that there is more than one way to understand our connection to our
"native land", just as there is more than one way to understand
"patriotism". --revwaf in Coconut Grove
LCShelly, thanks for your post. Something in it triggered something to
fit for me.
You see, no matter my gymnastics for sunday, I have a spiritual gut
feeling that I must somehow find a fit for July 4th celebrations and
the text. How to do so without reading into the text was giving me a
splitting headache until your post. Now I got some embers I am
fanning.
What if we imagine the 70 were as passionate about Jesus as we often
find ourselves passionate about our country? Such passion does tend to
make anyone who does not agree with us seem to be an enemy to be
annihilated. Could be that's why Jesus sat these folks down and gave
them Mission Manners 101. Could we borrow a leaf from Jesus on
Patriotism Manners 101?
Still fanning in the Spirit!
Story Teller
This is the first time I've done this so here goes. I too have been
struggling with just how to connect this text with our July 4th
context, although I feel that I need to bring it also to the context
of God's people here. At any rate I feel I may have somewhat of a
connection. There is no doubt about it thatwhat Jesus says in verse
two is true today. I feel as though I will work with "in the midst of
wolves." That certainly respresents to me the broken wrold in which we
live as well as our own shortcomings. (Acting like wolves, self-belief
and no peace with God) - as we are and are called to be lights and
beacons to a world which lives in darkness. (living in the light). We
have been given freedom through the cross and the resurrection = new
life in the hope of ushering in God's KIngdom. As far as the 4th, we
are God's people first and American citizens second. I believe I will
attempt to preach on how begin both is using the freedom God has given
us to strive for peace as well as the healing of humankind and how
that is the very hope of America when we say we are the land of the
free. At any rate it is still early --- those are my first thoughts.
Tom in TX
I don't see love of country as the same thing as dislike for other
countries. I am American, and I love the American people, but I also
love the people of France and Kenya and Korea and Peru. I don't like
the goverment or the systems found in China or Libya or Iran, but that
doesn't equate with a disdain for the people who live under those
governments. Because I am pro America doesn't mean I am anti anybody
else. It's not an either/or. To celebrate America's good points
doesn't mean America only has good points. Some American things
disturb me. Much of our history disturbs me. The present
administration disturbs me, but I still honor the government that was
set up in the 1770-1780's and the people who set it up.
To give thanks to God for the country we live in is right and proper
in my book. To give thanks for any of our blessings is right and
proper, and America is a blessing to the people I minister to. We will
be celebrating this blessing on Sunday but without flags and fireworks
in the Sanctuary. We'll do it with words and hymns that link this
country to God who is supposed to be its Head.
"Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord."
Betsy Ross
We have been the recipients of the choisest bounties of heaven; we
have been preserved these many years in peace and prosperity; we have
grown in numbers, wealth and power as no other nation has ever grown.
But we have forgotten God. We have forgotten the gracious hand which
preserved us in peace and multiplied and enriched and strengthened us,
and we have vainly imagined, in the deceitfulness of our hearts, that
all these blessings were produced by some superior wisdom and virtue
of our own. Intoxicated with unbroken success, we have become too
self-sufficient to feel the necessity of redeeming and preserving
grace, too proud to pray to the God that made us.
Abraham Lincoln
The appointed Gospel Reading for ECUSA is Matthew 5:43-48. It is a
midrash on Leviticus, "love your neighbor as yourself."
I think where I am headed is to talk about the division that exists in
our country. People no longer engage in dialogue or seek a common
understanding. The parish church ought to be a place where people may
freely discuss their political views without being demonized; the
church needs to hold before the world the common good (The Kingdom of
God) and in this case it has to do with mending the fabric of our
society.
We have let the media govern our points of view; I am not sure if we
actually know what we believe; we hold our thoughts and feelings in;
we do not open ourselves to debate for we fear oppositon, yet as
members of the Body of Christ our citizenship is elsewhere so we ought
to be open to the reality of difference and celebrate it as a mark of
our liberty.
tom in ga
hello all,
i rarely contribute here, mostly because i wind up reading all your
posts on saturday night, but i'm actually here on tuesday so here're
my 2 cents:
when we celebrated the 1 yr anniversary of 9/11 in an ecumenical
service i spoke about the flags fying at half-mast. i said that we
felt a little like those flags; that we are at half-mast. but... i
added that half-mast is not God's intention for us; that God's purpose
is to raise us up. i recieved several positive comments about this
image so i will share it for what it's worth.
i also would like to share this poem/prayer by ann weems which i love
In the godforsaken, obscene quicksand of life, there is a deafening
alleluia rising from the souls of those who weep, and of those who
weep with those who weep. If you watch, you will see the hand of God
putting the stars back in their skies one by one.
i found it in the book "All Will Be Well; A Gathering of Healing
Prayers" edited by Lyn Klug put out by augsburg fortress.
there is also a wonderful worship resource at elca.org for times of
war.
i also wanted to share my condolences with tammy at the death of your
daughter. i don't know any more than she died, but you have been in my
prayers. may God grant you peace.
christine at the shore
This Sunday seemed like a good time to receive the "Camping Ministries
Special Offering" requested by our Annual Conference. Much of the
service will have a "camping" theme, since that is a favorite summer
activity for many families. At this point I am planning only to make
nominal reference to Independence Day in prayer -- and the closing
hymn will be "America the Beautiful" as I try to avoid centering the
whole worship service around civic holidays, too.
My sermon title is "Trekking for Jesus" -- and yes, I did consider
that SOME might misconstrue this as being related to "trekkies" :>)).
I'm looking at how we are called to this amazing journey that takes us
places we aren't always prepared to go, as sometimes happens to hikers
and trekkers in the wilderness. It's early yet, so I'm not sure of all
the possible directions I might take with this, but the Lukan account
of the disciples heading off to do as Jesus bids them opens many
possibilities in my mind.
Robbie in KS
oil,
When quoting Abraham Lincoln (or Scripture, or anyone else for that
matter), please have the courtesy to respect the speaker (author,
etc.) by separating his or her quoted words from your insertions with
quotation marks. It doesn't bother me as much with the Scripture,
because I know it well enough to know what is inserted and what is
not. But when you quote others, like A.L. or another contributor to
this site, I am less certain what is original.
In love, Michelle.
Our Vacation Bible School will be the week after this one (July 12-16)
so this passage works perfectly with a plan to canvas our area on
Friday night to invite area children to the VBS. I'm thinking of this
as my three point outline.
I. Harvest (10:1-3) This point will cover much of what my 6/28/04 post
covered - don't look at the hinderances; look to the harvest.
II. Hallelujah (10:17-19) When we do go out to share Christ with
others, we need to return to a celebration. Christ speaks empowering
words to His dedicated workers and reminds them that Satan, however
powerful he may seem, is fallen and has lost. Christ has the victory.
III. Heaven (10:20) Temporal victories can be enjoyed temporally.
There is an eternal victory and this is the one we cling to - our
names are written in heaven.
I need to write this early since I have houseguests coming and my wife
wants me to be ... well ... civil. I'm not terribly civil when writing
my sermon, I suspect.
JG in WI
Thanks, JJ in KS, for pointing out the healing theme in the three
texts. It was so obvious that I almost overlooked it.
I think I will try to blend healing with freedom somehow. Freedom to
choose or reject personal healing (Naaman or today's Eucharist).
Freedom to offer or withhold healing within the Christian community
(Eucharist). Freedom to embrace our commission to offer healing to our
nation and world, or the freedom to turn our backs on our
responsibility as healers/reconcilers (Holy Spirit's empowerment
through the Eucharist).
These thoughts connect well to last week's text from Galatians 5:13,
"For you were called to freedom, brothers and sisters; only do not use
your freedom as an opportunity for self-indulgence, but through love
become slaves to one another."
Does this make sense? Or am I out on a limb? Thanks for any attempt
toward hemming me in...
RB in PA
It would only seem right that the person who wrote the third entry
give credit where credit is due. It comes verbatim from "Sundays and
Seasons 2004", published by Augusburg Publishing House. 2003.
I've noticed for a number of weeks now. I don't have a problem that it
is shared, but at least give the source.
Story teller (another one!) lurking on the side
Perhaps the perspective of this will be helpful:
Lord God Almighty, in whose Name the founders of this country won
liberty for themselves and for us, and lit the torch of freedom for
nations yet unborn: Grant that we and all of the people of this land
may have grace to maintain our liberties in righteousness and peace;
throught Jesus Christ our Lord, who lives and reigns with you and the
Holy Spirit, one God, for ever and ever. Amen
Collect for Independence day, Book of Common Prayer
GEC in Mich
Excuse me if I'm riding my hobby horse, but here's another good one:
Almighty God, who hast given us this good land for our heritage: We
humbly beseech thee that we may always prove ourselves a people
mindful of thy favor and glad to do thy will. Bless our land with
honorable industry, sound learning, and pure manners. Save us from
violence, discord, and confusion; from pride and arrogance, and from
every evil way. Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united
people the multitudes brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues.
Endue with the spirit of wisdom those to whom in thy Name we entrust
the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at
home, and that, through obedience to thy law, we may show forth thy
praise among the nations of the earth. In the time of prosperity, fill
our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not
our trust in thee to fail; all which we ask through Jesus Christ our
Lord. Amen.
p. 820 Book of Common Prayer
And another:
28. In Times of Conflict
O God, you have bound us together in a common life. Help us, in the
midst of our struggles for justice and truth, to confront one another
without hatred or bitterness, and to work together with mutual
forbearance and respect; through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.
GEC in Mich
GEC in Mich thank you for sharing those prayers. I think they will be
a basis for the prayers I will write for our bulletin (with proper
credit, of course)
Dear oil, You are indeed in love, and are probably either bewildered
or affirmed at your reception here. You have the message, no doubt,
but are ignoring your audience. Jesus nearly always told stories to
get his message across. Will you witness to us by telling your story?
Max in NC
Oil/Soil/Boil/Toil,
What is the opposite of opposite?
Just wondering.
The opposite of love is indifference, not hate.
~~Paulo
I get really nervous and uncomfortable when patriotism, even in the
most innocent spirit, is promoted from the pulpit. Our Kingdom is not
of this world. There are 23 other hours in the day to celebrate our
nation's birthday. Can't we at least give God our full attention for
an hour?
PC in GA (Christian first, American second, Right Wing-Knee
Jerk-Republican third)
I totally agree with PC in GA (Christian first, American second, Right
Wing-Knee Jerk-Republican third)
Pr.del in Ia (Christian first, compassionate intellectual liberal
second)
Just to add to what GEC has offered, I particularly like (and we will
use in my congregation) a responsive prayer of thanksgiving for
national life found on pp 838-39 of the ECUSA Book of Common Prayer:
Thanksgivings for National Life
5. For the Nation
Prayer Leader: Almighty God, giver of all good things: We thank you
for the natural majesty and beauty of this land. They restore us,
though we often destroy them.
Response: Heal us.
Prayer Leader: We thank you for the great resources of this nation.
They make us rich, though we often exploit them.
Response: Forgive us.
Prayer Leader: We thank you for the men and women who have made this
country strong. They are models for us, though we often fall short of
them.
Response: Inspire us.
Prayer Leader: We thank you for the torch of liberty which has been
lit in this land. It has drawn people from every nation, though we
have often hidden from its light.
Response: Enlighten us.
Prayer Leader: We thank you for the faith we have inherited in all its
rich variety. It sustains our life, though we have been faithless
again and again.
Response: Renew us.
Prayer Leader: Help us, O Lord, to finish the good work here begun.
Strengthen our efforts to blot out ignorance and prejudice, and to
abolish poverty and crime. And hasten the day when all our people,
with many voices in one united chorus, will glorify your holy Name.
Response: Amen.
Eric in OH
Story teller:
I disagree: Jesus says "Wipe the dust off .. IN PROTEST AGAINST them
..."
Your point is a good one, nonetheless. I think we've all had to
distance ourselves from being hurt (and I do think Jesus was helping
the disciples practice what Friedman called 'nonanxious presence,' or
what others call 'healthy boundaries') because it hurts to be
rejected! Very few clergypeople I know haven't been rejected
somewhere... In fact, there was a period of time when I felt like the
primary qualification for being a pastor was having a high tolerance
for abuse!!!
Your point is dead-on in this way: not all are going to "take" to our
particular way. It's not that we have different messages (all of us on
this site endeavor to preach the Divine love of God through Christ and
what his salvation means to us in 2004), but that we have differing
passions about how Jesus' message plays out. Some will be liberal,
others conservative ... some will be compelled to preach IN LOVE until
they feel they're heard ...
Sally
Bammamma: (sorry, y'all; I've been away for a few days and I'm
catching up bit by bit - hence, the multiple posts)
I like your sermon title - and if I'm interpreting it correctly, I'd
add "co-dependent" to your list! God-dependent gives us authority to
do a lot of stuff we couldn't if we had to be dependent on other
people!
Sally
I agree that patriotism doesn't belong in the worship (I haven't
chosen any patriotic hymns, nor will I inlcude any special liturgy b/c
of July 4th); I've chosen hymns based on the Scriptures this week, and
I can't think of any of them that "fit" these scriptures. That said, I
would be remiss to neglect the context of my preaching when I prepare
my sermon and part of that context is July 4th which here in America
has special meaning and with a renewed patriotic fervor these past few
years (personally, I'm somewhat embarassed by our country's actions
both in Iraq and Israel/Palestine). I like the idea of "God Dependent"
but I'm wondering if it's really God dependence leads to our own
independence and interdependence or does God dependence negate the
others? I don't know - are we looking for everything when we think we
can truly be independent? Is independence all it's cracked up to be? I
knew I should have taken this week as my vacation! Continuing to
struggle and praying for divine guidance, LCShelly inVT
LCShelly in VT Thanks for you questions concerning "God dependent." In
suggesting this title, I am speaking out of my own experience. As a
retired pastor, looking back through my life, I have found that the
more I surrendered all to God, and depended upon God's direction, (and
I am including all of God: Creator, Redeemer and Sustainer ), then I
naturally became more independent and interdependent (and i see it
still happening).
Here is an example of my reasoning: (no, this will not be part of my
sermon). When I was born at home, my mother ran into problems, and
since there was no emergency supplies, my family was told by the
doctor,that she would die. She did not. When I look back on this, it
is as if God reached out and gave all care to my mom, so she could
have her dream of caring for her daughter. I see those hours of her
crisis as am example of "God dependency" for both her and me, and the
beginning our interdependence, but that we were independent as two
individuals.
In the Old Testament reading, It was not just Naaman and Elisha, but
the slave girl, and Naaman's servants involved in the healing.
In the Psalter, "Weeping may linger for the night, but joy comes with
the morning."
Here in the Gospel, instructions from Jesus, "take nothing..." is
instructions for God dependency.
And the Epistle, from which I will be preaching: Galatians 6:14 "May I
never boast of anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by
which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world"
Shalom bammamma
bammama~
i too liked the "dependance" thinking about this sunday. i often like
to use the word vunerable. there is something about vunerability in
this text. ie being sent out into the world without anything but the
word and christ's promises. we really don't like to be vunerable
because it leaves us open to so many hurts. i think that's why jesus
wanted the disciples to shake off the dust when they weren't accepted.
how often will we stay (especially as pastors) in situations where we
want to make things right, have people "get" what we are saying, when
the have no interest whatsoever. feeling as though we have failed (at
anything) makes us feel much more than uncomfortable... it makes us
think that we are vunerable. how great that jesus tells us that those
things that make us feel vunerable are really those things that make
us strong.
ok, so these are just ramblings. i'm struggling with the text too and
really appreciate this site.
God's peace, christine at the shore
FYI: Mormon Missionaries are known to shake the dust off of their feet
when leaving the house of an unbeliever or Christian Apologist who
questions their belief system (stuff like Jesus and Lucifer are Spirit
brothers; the Holy Ghost is a man who had intercourse with Mary;
surrogate baptism of the dead; the faithful will each get their own
planet in the Celestial Kingdom).
~~PC in GA
from the webster dictionary oil (n) Any of numerous mineral,
vegetable, and synthetic substances and animal and vegetable fats that
are generally slippery, combustible, viscous, liquid or liquefiable at
room temperatures, soluble in various organic solvents such as ether
but not in water, and used in a great variety of products, especially
lubricants and fuels.
Petroleum. A petroleum derivative, such as a machine oil or lubricant.
A substance with an oily consistency. Oil paint. A painting done in
oil paint. Insincere flattery.
oil~ i think that part of the problem here (and perhaps i should just
stay out of this) is that you sound insincere especially since you
told this group that your personal story doesn't matter. i find it
interesting that the night i decided to join this group tammy
announced that her daughter had died and the people here were so
loving to her because personal stories do matter. you have even gone
so far as to not answer the question if you are pastoring a church or
not.
right now you are coming across as insincere. you don't even keep your
name the same with each post, but come up with something cute that
honestly comes off as being trite.
we are called to speak the truth in love, but we are called to speak
the truth. so here it is: the opposite of love is not hate, but apathy
(or indifference as someone mentioned before.) from my short week here
i think people are becoming indifferent to what you are saying. or,
perhaps i should say that i am becoming indifferent, rather than
speaking for people i do not yet know.
i probably should just delete this contribution, but i suppose i will
send it in hopes that you might "hear" my message before i choose to
wipe the dust from my feet and simply skip your posts... which would
be a shame... because somewhere deep down in them is a person who has
some good points and some good stuff to contribute.
i guess i'm asking you to stop hiding behind the word love and begin
to be a real "preacher" when you make your posts.
God's peace, christine at the shore
10:18 He said to them, "I watched Satan fall from heaven like a flash
of lightning."
What a wonderful vision for Independence Day!
Just joking in the early planning moments for me...
blessings,
pulpitt in ND
